Gregory (Greg) L. Snow Ph.D.
Statistical Data Center
Intermountain Healthcare
greg.snow at imail.org
801.408.8111
> -----Original Message-----
> From: r-help-bounces at r-project.org [mailto:r-help-bounces at r-
> project.org] On Behalf Of Thomas Mang
> Sent: Thursday, January 29, 2009 3:52 PM
> To: r-help at stat.math.ethz.ch
> Subject: Re: [R] bootstrapping in regression
>
> Greg Snow wrote:
> > What you are describing is actually a permutation test rather than a
> bootstrap (related concepts but with a subtle but important
> difference).
> >
> > The way to do a permutation test with multiple x's is to fit the
> reduced model (use all x's other than x1 if you want to test x1) on the
> original data and store the fitted values and the residuals.
> >
> > Permute the residuals (randomize their order) and add them back to
> the fitted values and fit the full model (including x1 this time) to
> the permuted data set. Do this a bunch of times and it will give you
> the sampling distribution for the slope on x1 (or whatever your set of
> interest is) when the null hypothesis that it is 0 given the other
> variables in the model is true.
>
> Hi,
>
> Thanks to you and Tom for the correction regarding bootstrapping vs
> permutation, and to Chuck for the cool link. Yes of course I described
> a
> permutation.
>
> I have a question here: I am not sure if I understand your 'fit the
> full
> model ... to the permuted data set'. Am I correct to suppose that once
> the residuals of the reduced-model fit have been permuted and added
> back
> to the fitted values, the values obtained this way (fitted + permuted
> residuals) now constitute the new y-values to which the full model is
> fitted? Is that correct ?
> Do you know if this procedure is also valid for a mixed-effects model ?
>
> thanks a lot,
> Thomas
>
>
> > Permuting just x1 only works if x1 is orthogonal to all the other
> predictors, otherwise the permuting destroys the relationship with the
> other predictors and does not do the test you want.
> >
> > Bootstrapping depends on sampling with replacement, not permuting,
> and is used more for confidence intervals than for tests (the reference
> by John Fox given to you in another reply can help if that is the
> approach you want to take).
> >
> > Hope this helps,
> >
>
> ______________________________________________
> R-help at r-project.org mailing list
> https://stat.ethz.ch/mailman/listinfo/r-help
> PLEASE do read the posting guide http://www.R-project.org/posting-
> guide.html
> and provide commented, minimal, self-contained, reproducible code.