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glmmADMB definition of levels for random component

Juan Jos? Santos Blanco <juan.santos at ...> writes:
Actually, I believe that you will get exactly the same answer from
these two approaches.  What you're assuming in either case is that
the distribution *within* years of trips, or the distribution within
trips of hauls, is the same across years (or hauls).  Specifically,
you're assuming something like

  y_ijk ~ beta_i + eps_{ij} + gamma_{ijk}

where i=year, j=trip, k=haul ...

  You could try out the two different approaches (possibly on
 a subset of your data, or a simpler/made-up example) and
confirm for yourself that they do indeed give the same answers ...

   Ben Bolker